Propellerhead Record Is Not A DAW!

propellerhead-recordSorry, readers.

We have a correction to make. A mea culpa to fess up to. A blogging confession.

Earlier today, we reported on Propellerhead Record, calling it “a new digital audio workstation application” (DAW).

We use the term digital audio workstation, like pretty much the whole world, to refer to “an electronic system designed to record, edit and play back digital audio.”

Propellerheads Software contacted us, though, to ask us to not to refer to Propellerhead Record as a DAW:

It is NOT a DAW and we’d appreciate it if you didn’t refer to Record as a DAW.

Yep, we told you wrong. So we want to be the first to set the record straight.

Propellerhead Record Is Not A DAW

When Propellerhead explains that Record is an application for recording, arranging and mixing audio, that little lightbulb went off in our minds and we thought “Propellerhead Record = DAW”.

Our bad!

We corrected our previous article on Propellerhead Record to help eliminate any confusion over whether Record is a DAW:

Propellerhead Software has officially unveiled Record, not a digital audio workstation application, but ” a whole new take on music recording” that “combines effortless recording and a stunning software mixer console with a limitless rack of audio processing gear that builds itself or can be infinitely customized.”

We’re not sure why Propellerhead is sensitive about the “DAW” term, but we figure that the company’s trying to carve out its own space in the marketplace, and not trying to compete feature to feature against DAW’s like Apple’s Logic Pro.

Propellerhead Record will retail for $299. Add in the cost of Propellerhead Reason, and you’re looking at some fairly serious dough to put together a complete Propellerhead-based recording solution – that’s not a DAW – compared to a full-fledged DAW like Apple Logic ($500).

Time will tell if Propellerhead Record can carve out a new place in the market – a place for audio recording and mixing applications that don’t try to compete against full-fledged digital audio workstations.

What do you think of Propellerhead Record and the idea that it’s not a DAW? Leave a comment with your thoughts!

Leave a Reply

136 thoughts on “Propellerhead Record Is Not A DAW!

  1. Traditionally, DAW refers to both a software *and* hardware combination e.g. ProTools TDM, which Record certainly is not. The Wikipedia article linked acknowledges this and distinguishes between DAWs and "DAW programs" like Logic, Sonar, etc…

    So Propellerheads certainly has an argument, though it is a pedantic one.

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  2. My mistake, the original blog post referred to Record as a "digital audio workstation APPLICATION" … which fits the traditional criteria.

    Therefore, I have no idea what Propellerheads' issue is.

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  3. Haha, the Propellerheads marketing people are vicious 🙂

    It's a DAW. Like Garageband is a DAW. They can sugarcoat it all they want but that's how people will think of it.

    – It has multi tracks of audio & midi
    – It has linear and loop-based recording and timeline
    – It has audio effects for processing
    – It has a handy virtual mixer…
    – The obvious parts of the workflow scream "DAW", regardless of the magic under the hood

    Etc etc.

    It's obviously not a DAW like Logic/PT, which retail for a similar price (I think Reason+Record is something like $500, the same price as Logic), yet those things have more "pro audio features." It costs less than Ableton Studio…

    I know there's actually a bunch of stuff under the covers of Record that is pretty neat and makes it pretty easy to use, which a lot of people will like.

    So I dunno, I'm a HUGE fan of their stuff, so I'm getting it, I like the Reason workflow so it's right up my alley. It's really not for everyone. In the PC marketplace they could make a killing in the Garageband market segment and honestly the music world will be better off for it.

    As someone in the software industry, I think it's smart move but I think the pricing especially is a little problematic. Even the standalone Record is $250, which for audio software these days isn't bad, but I would expect the standalone Record to sit more in the 100-150 range, especially for a 1.0 product and the expected user range (and the fact that it doesn't have Reason). I might change my mind after I use the beta, who knows. I'm still buying it, they make great products, though I swore I'd never get another piece of software with a dongle after I dumped PT for Logic. Grrr…!

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  4. Sorry Propellerheads, I loved Rebirth, it set the stage, I love Reason (bought it and use it nearly every day), but I'm sad to say… Record is a DAW. It's digital, no way to argue against that. It manages audio, and would be useless without it. And lastly, it's a workstation as you can record & cut & paste & add & subtract & everything else you'd need from a bit o' software, just like every other DAW out there. So, Props out for the technological advance this surely embodies, and I love y'all from 20 to 20,000 hz, but seriously get off your high horse. Congratulations, it's a DAW!
    And really, giving your staunchest supporters and early reviewers for mentioning the obvious just makes you look like douches, and I know you're not douches, so just quit it.

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  5. It's a DAW.
    Well, it was when you copied it from Apple. When it was called GARAGEBAND!

    What dicks. Seriously.

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  6. You're forgetting to mention that for current registered Reason owners Record will cost $150. And if they call it a DAW or not, who cares… If the thing is just a bit as reliable and stable as Reason, it will be very good… If only it accepted VSTs…

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  7. It's not a DAW, it's a recording application. DAW has a stigma and certain requirements
    that Propellerheads don't need to fulfill. They make their own rules and create innovative applications that don't fit the mold. This is bold, exciting and new… people have a
    hard time accepting new things… Reason itself is self explanatory of such a venture that works wonders for the artist that doesn't want the "DAW standard".

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  8. Holy crap, that's anal.

    They could have at least invented a catching new name for a previously understandable category of gear.

    Like "shoulder synthesizer."

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  9. Sorry, Ex3, but this is not bold or exciting. A DAW is a 'recording application'. I'm not sure what stigma being called a DAW has, other than entering the market at this time has got to be a tough nut to crack.

    I'm not going to say it's not a rock-solid, intuitive way to record audio to your audio – mostly because I haven't used it, but also because Props are known for their stability. But to try to spin this as something 'revolutionary' is pretty much the height of marketing bullshit. It's got a mixer, for chrissake. Want to make a revolutionary way to sequence audio, I don't know, about a Object Oriented Mixing screen with 3D objects that come into focus as you need them. But faders, and EQs, and compressors. Every 'recording application' has that. And it's got a goddamn sequencing window.

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  10. I wouldn't say a DAW is simply a "recording application", if that was all it that was required then the sound recorder in windows is also a DAW.

    However, yeah, Record is definitely a DAW, it performs the audio editing features that define a DAW. Honestly, this is all a marketing ploy to try and convince people that they won't be competing with the likes of Logic and Protools, which is a ridiculous notion.

    It's also worth pointing out that most of Reasons serious users are probably already rewiring it to a DAW, so therefore by trying to advertise Record as "not-a-DAW" they're hoping to convince Reason users that it is something that won't be redundant or in competition with their current setup.

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  11. Oh, come on! its generally a DAW! The only things that are missing are VST support, audio editing, scoring maybe, etc…False, stupid marketing for Propellerhead!

    Anyway, at this price and without vst support, its not going to fly out from the stores…there are much more applications which do the same or similar job at lower prices.

    I agree though, as a basic concept it seems good. Its like having a high end mixing console and an nice multitrack recorder along with some basic effects. Simple and effective.It could work if it had a price of $100.

    However they want to call it, technically is a DAW though…

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  12. It's a DAW! Yep it's painfully obvious to all why they don't want to call it a DAW. Given the price of Reason and Record and the features they offer, you'd have to be insane to chose them over another DAW. So what if it's rock solid when it's synths and effects are hopelessly outdated? Fiddling with virtual cables for five minutes just because you want to change the order of a few effects? What a joke. If you persist with using Reason and you recognize that rewiring it to Logic, Cubase, Live etc is the only way to get it to sound good then Record offers you nothing. Why would you want it? From the marketing It comes across as aimed at noobs who'll buy it before realizing they've made a mistake. Ooo, create a new track with two mouse clicks! Big deal, I can do this in Logic with one keyboard shortcut, and anyway if you're not using a template song with blank tracks ready to go, then you should probably rethink your strategy. After the disappointing Reason 4 release I dumped it for Logic and have never looked back.

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  13. A rose by any other name, my friend. We all know what it is, we all know what it does, we all call it the same thing–DAW. And this bold, exciting and new product is actually pretty boring. You see, I've owned a macbook for several months now and garageband came with it. for free. and logic studio was $150 pre-installed.
    So yea, for half (HALF!) the cost of record, you can get a *real* DAW that does *real* things like load the VST collection you've invested in. Maybe because it's so expensive they needed to dream up a 'bold, exciting and new' way to keep people from pirating it. Good thing propellerhead invented a slightly-less-infuriating-than-8-years-ago USB dongle system! YAY!
    Dear propellerhead: Record should be re-named to Superfluous. Lose the dongle and i might pirate it till version 3.0 and then buy a full license like i did for reason. Good luck trying to charge people $300 for garageband that is "protected" with additional hardware requirements.

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  14. garageband comes free with your mac. If you use Reason and you wish Record was a VST host as well, it's obvious that you rewire Reason into a *real* daw (as most sane people who for some reason want to play with Reason do.) So why in the world would a "discount" to purchase Record be of any use to you? I mean, honestly.. Record doesn't actually *DO* anything, at least when compared with your current DAW + Reason setup. The ironic, and slightly humorous thing is that everyone's gripe with reason is that its not a vst host, but it is actually just a VSTi itself. I mean, if you rewire it into Live, you may as well just shift the workload over to some vst's within live and save your compute cycles, money, mind, and ears.

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  15. Many sane people who want to 'play' with Reason are quite happy to do so without the need to record audio at all. Reason offers a standalone package in which you can create entire tracks, which is certainly a lot more than being 'just a VSTi'. Just because that's how you use it doesn't mean that' s the only way it can be used.

    Personally, I want to record as well. The advantage of Record over a combination of Reason + any other DAW will be ease of use. As all of your Reason instruments will be available in Record, you won't have to keep switching forwards and backwards between devices or setting up busses to route signals back and forth, a factor which will make it worthwhile to many people who love the unique way of working that Reason offers. Not forgetting the fact that you will be able to quickly and easily route audio signals through effects chains in a way that mimics real world patching (one of my favourite features of Reason).

    Oh, and judging by the amount of power that Reason takes up, I would imagine that I'll get a great deal more audio tracks out of Record than I can with Logic.

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  16. I think the point im trying to get across here is that Reason + Record = DAW with no vst support. So what we have is a DAW that actually does less than any other DAW on the market, except it costs about as much as a fully-fledged DAW that works. Yes, a DAW without vst support qualifies as "broken" in my book. Then again, I and virtually everyone I know has paid a pretty penny for the contents of /vstinstruments. If FLStudio is around half the cost, many times more useful, and has an established and thriving user base. Logic studio is also dirt cheap when bundled with a new mac, and the upgrade to Pro is relatively painless and wont break the bank. Live 8 is actually really really fun, and they'll give you the express version with almost any maudio product that can then be upgraded to full version pretty cheaply. I've never played much with pro tools for the same reason I will never play with Record–the dongle!
    This is an example of a product with no market. I predict only hard-core Reason fans will be into Record, and honestly that damn dongle thing will turn off many people. Well, the dongle will probably turn off paying customers. No one likes to deal with those things, especially people who's time is worth money. Now when you have someone who's time is worthless–like some 13 year old ukranian kid–it'll be a matter of days before him and 9000 of his closest friends on IRC are distributing cracks sans-dongle.
    Sorry, the dongle rant is best left for another time, i can go on for days…

    And as for getting more tracks out of Record than Logic… I've never been able to even see the ceiling with Logic as far as track count goes.. A theoretically infinite amount of audio tracks loses a bit of meaning when you consider the practical limit of the amount of tracks you'd ever really use.

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  17. Fair enough. I've never actually pushed Logic all that hard myself, mainly because I find the interface so incredibly off-putting. I remember the first time I loaded it up and sat there working through the quick-start guide, staring at an empty grey screen for what seemed like hours whilst all the enthusiasm I felt about new software drained out of me. I'm not exactly a novice with DAWs (I've used Pro-Tools a fair bit and CuBase to a lesser extent), although I'm certainly no expert, but the learning curve for Logic was incredibly intimidating. By contrast, I fired up Reason, was building a track within minutes, and I've never looked back.

    I do agree with you about the dongle though. That is a pain in the arse, but the fact that you can log in online does go a long way towards putting my mind at ease about it.

    As far as plug-ins go, you may find this odd, but I actually like the fact that it doesn't support them. Admittedly, I may have felt differently if I had a selection that I wanted to use, but I never had a huge collection and those that I did own have equivalents in Reason. But I find the fact that you are limited to what comes in the box incredibly inspiring. It was always easy on ProTools to think that some new plug in would serve my needs and allow me to finish off this track, or that it would somehow make me feel creative again. In Reason I make the best of what I've got, I find workarounds, I'm forced to come up with alternatives and as a result I'm more likely to surprise myself. It's not a way of working that suits everyone, but personally, I absolutely love it. It just feels more natural and organic somehow. Especially when I'm fiddling around with signal paths to try and do something new.

    Although that brings up an interesting point: you complain about the cost of Reason when compared to other DAWs, but then you talk about all of the money you've spent on VSTis. Surely in the long run, you'll be spending more money on DAWs that you have to buy plug-ins for than you would if you purchased these two programmes that do (very nearly) everything out of the box?

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  18. The way I look at it is this: The DAW should be a whole studio, done digitally. It should be able to do anything a real, reasonably equipped studio can do. You can bring any instrument to any studio anywhere in the world to play it and record it. VSTi's are instruments, just digital ones. In my twisted little world view a DAW that can't play virtual instruments is like a mixing board with no inputs. It is because of this that I don't think of Reason as a "virtual studio" but more like a really in-depth, multi-use virtual instrument.
    That is also how i justify spending money on VST's. It's exactly like going and getting that Virus you've been drooling over, except it's a lot cheaper and takes up a hell of a lot less space. It's every bit as useful as a real instrument, as far as my purposes go. Even if i had a Virus, it'd be sitting next to my laptop, so why not simply use software instead? Since every DAW that will admit to being a DAW is also a vst host, I should never run into trouble not being able to play my instruments. So yea, the total cost of my VST habit is pretty high, but i count that as my "instrument" budget, and if I had to achieve that all with hardware, I'd be out of money and room in my house.
    I also agree with you about working within confines, but when it comes to digital, there should be no limitations whatsoever. As far as the software itself is concerned, I mean. I'd much rather limit myself with an artificial limitation rather than a physical one. For example, if you want to be forced to work within certain confines then simply set little rules and goals for yourself within that one project. You don't have to use any external instruments if you dont want to, but i firmly believe you should be able to if you wanted. I love working with limitations, but almost always with hardware only. My EMX was my last fling and I loved her just because i had to work within the limitations of just that single box. As I've said tho, to me a DAW is a total solution. Different DAWs have different ideas of how to go about achieving that totality, but in the end, if there's a limit–especially a glaringly-obtuse one as this–it's not complete enough.

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  19. That's a fair criticisms of Logic vs Reason, and I think that's why people are so rabid about Reason.

    Logic is powerful but has a steep learning curve, – which is kind of strange since Apple's known for their usability.

    Reason's more of a no-brainer, mainly because of all the stuff that they left out.

    My disappointment with Propellerhead Record is that they're doing a Reason-style DAW, making it easier by limiting what you can do, instead of coming up with a radically new way to do serious work.

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  20. Because if its compared to other DAW's in a little feature grid (which I am sure the other DAW publishers are preparing as we speak) it will be come glaringly obvious that its an exceptionally crappy DAW. So they want desperately for it to NOT be called a DAW. If the public perceives it as such, it will be compared to other DAWs and it will be doomed.

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  21. It's what is generally considered a digital audio workstation so I'm calling it DAW. It's not an amazing workstation but it's a pretty damn Reason addon program. I'll buy it to go with my Reason 4.0 setup. I'll also render the audio tracks from Record to tweak in my other DAW programs.

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  22. Propellerhead would like to insist that the thing waddling around the yard with a bill and webbed feet going "quack" is NOT A DUCK. And while they're at it, the sky is not blue, rain is not wet, and women are not crazy.

    Here's an idea… while you're insisting that it's not a DAW, how about not saddling it with with a dongle like certain other DAWs that this is not like.

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  23. Wow. You're a very angry man.

    Is it not just possible that some people actually like the way Reason works? And not just 'noobs' either. I used to use ProTools constantly, and I've dabbled with Cubase and Logic. I simply prefer Reason, the way it works and the way it sounds (for my money, everything in Logic sounds like generic synths and therefore entirely inappropriate for the sort of music I want to make).

    And some people get a kick out of the flexibility offered by being able to route their signal paths. Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean that everyone who does is some sort of fool. They're just different to you.

    I also think you'll find that the people who do use Reason don't Rewire it to 'make it sound good', they do so in order to be able to do certain things which they aren't able to do in Reason itself, just as they use Reason in the first place as it does things that no other music package allows them to.

    Now, might I suggest a nice lie down, and maybe some deep breathing?

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  24. Semantically, yes, Record is a DAW. But conventionally, we think of a DAW as being designed to handle every audio function under the sun. And Record clearly isn't. Compared to (other) DAWs, it's either "extremely specialized' or "extremely limited" depending on your angle. A lot like the old MacOS vs Windows debate.

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  25. It is not a DAW to me if I cannot do all of my audio work inside it… No VST-Support no Fine Tune Audio Editing – FL Studio is more of DAW than this thing.

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  26. If Sound Forge & Audacity are DAWS then I agree with yall… But if not, Then I'm calling it a Virtual Studio with no upgrade room!!!

    Still getting it though but I wonder if the audio processing quality will better ProTools as I haven't run into a program with plugins that rival it.

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  27. "Propellerhead would like to insist that the thing waddling around the yard with a bill and webbed feet going "quack" is NOT A DUCK"

    what if its a scuba diver, with his flippers on,
    and he's complaining about his invoice from his psychiatrist?

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  28. until they ad vst the only one i wil be using is a crack one if its any good i dont think they should be limiting their costmers. dongle i can accept vst impossible to live without.

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  29. I love Propellerheads innovations so far up until now, but this smell like its going to be a huge epic fail. I hope Im wrong for there sake, but I doubt it.
    What where they thinking?

    "Yeah lets make an easy, dumb down version of a real daw cuz people are to stupid to understand them anyway!….Yeah and lets add a dongle…and skip vst support, vst is way to complicated for people anyway.."

    Eh…naaaaaa, sorry thats just aint gonna work.

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  30. I think they are right on the mark with record. Aimed at bands and not studio people is really something thats needed. I work in a studio and have had hundreds of band come in and record more or less good stuff. These days more and more want to experiment with recording because studios are too expensive. They buy logic or pro tools and they never get a good sound because the learning curve is too steep.

    If record is rock stable like reason ( ive used reason every day since it came out and it has never chrashed on me !! ) and easy like the demo suggests they have a winner. Well they could have the world is an unpredictable place..

    Even for me owning Logic and Ableton live ( both whom i love intensely ) i still want Record.. just because it looks fun to use.

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    1. Record is rock stable because it is a closed-environment. I may have a few crashes with the odd ball VST or VSTi but at least I can infinitely expand my instrument collection unlike Reason while only experiencing the rare, occasional crash or bug. Its a welcome trade off to me.

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  31. I just want to know how can you "record' into RECORD will it be like protools with the mboxs and digiracks what will propeller head offer for mics and instruments to plug in

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  32. I use Reason extensively for some of my clients. I also use Logic, Sonar, Pro Tools and Even Reaper. I have only just started experimenting with Record, however, so far so good. I can see it being a useful addition to Reason, and I couldn't care less if it's called a DAW or not. It seems like a cool way to get audio into reason, without having to run it as a rewire device. As it's still in Beta test stage, it seems a little premature for all the criticism, from what I have seen so far, the guys at Propellerhead seem to listen to the end users of their products, and use the feedback to make improvements. Still, I guess some people will never be happy.

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  33. its shit iv used it for a while now and its badly thought out seems rushed they have basically left out all dance music heads no live performance features it is basically bollocks for 2009 it is more like a daw than ableton and ableton calls its self a daw ??????? WTF big big no no from me they couldn't even implement rebirth into reason 1 that's the sort of company your dealing with one that doesn't listen to its users or care about them very much at all, and this will come back and bite them right in the ass arrogant devs .

    if you want to sell something give people what they want or just keep it to yourself. no one i know will buy this rubbish. ha ha its not a daw strange it has borrowed many aspects from one, o and its just as complicated to use for NE one brainwashed by there lame marketing efforts honestly what a joke the props have defiantly lost it if they think people want to go out and buy line six products just to make there own amp Sims its all very poorly thought out what a waste . any one bigging it up is just a fanboi or is getting paid to speak highly of it end of.

    people will read more and more blogs like this and they are just going to not buy it unless it comes bundled with line 6 gash who the fuck listens to the people in future and other mags they will big up anything .

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  34. A bit of an old post, I know, but I have some words to say.

    As a long time Reason user (since v1.0 on Windows), I've always been looking for a stable DAW application to Rewire with Reason. My plan was to get Logic and use a Mac, but the introduction of Record looks right down my street.

    I can understand the marketing guys wanting it not called a DAW, because quite frankly, it isn't. It's the age old debate about what is a DAW and what isn't still goes around. Take, for example, Adobe Audition 1.5. Many people call it a DAW, but it isn't due to the lack of MIDI/VST instruments support. The same way Record isn't a DAW due to having no "fine tune" audio editor. I'll leave it at that. Say what you think, and I'll just say that it is a great application. 😀

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  35. Not interested in the application but pure and simple matter of fact is Record isn’t a DAW anymore than Garageband or Cooledit/Audition or Reason or Fruityloops is a DAW. It doesnt take a genius to discern the differences.

    That conversation aside though, pretty crazy/ridiculous Propellerheads would bother correcting people.

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  36. For the life of me I can't understand this entering the market without Vst support. I've been checking up on Record for a while now and like the look and features a lot. Nevertheless I'm not going to buy it. Without Vst it does not add anything to my existing setup. Surely you'll be able to rewire, but I never liked that workaround. Actually for the same reason I didn't buy Reason. It's all very cool graphically, but the way they protect their formats and the total frame makes it useless for me.Innovation should set you free, not limit you as much as possible. For the record, I boycott any software that makes me pay extra for its copy protection.

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    1. Nah, the sky is no constant colour. Look straight up and then to the horizon – two completely different colours. But if you ask a painter, the cliché colour of the sky is cerulean blue, definitely not cyan.

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  37. I'm sticking with live, as this won't have VST support – doesn't make sense. I learned most of what I know because I started playing around on reason, but only use it for rewire now. There is something about its output that lacks a certain sound quality found in all other apps i've used. It forever sounds compressed and lacks top-end sparkle…Lets hope Record is different in that respect!

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  38. CALL IT A AIRPLANE FOR ALL I CARE… IM NOT GETTING CAUGH UP IN NAMES!!! IF IT WORKS FLAWLESS, BIG UP TO PROPELLERHEAD! I JUST WONDER ABOUT PLUGGINS WORKING WITH IT. SUCH AS SSL WAVES, ETC…. IF ITS FLAWLESS, IM GETTING IT!

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  39. ive been driving RECORD since the beta dropped. 5-8 hours a day inside RECORD has been a fantastic ride. Is it a DAW? who cares, but yes and no. what i do know is that when im inside RECORD i can forget my fancy education in music production/engineering and just rail. You dont have to be a scientist to run RECORD…nor do you need miles of tutorials and half-assed how to books…im reminded of school and the pro tools 101 text book…um, joke? who cares if RECORD is a DAW and what propellerhead is trying to do market wise. RECORD is downright brilliant.

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  40. Technically, I would agree with Propellerhead that this is not a real DAW. It is a self-contained recording program. I've been testing the beta version and yes, it is stable, undoubtedly frill uncomplicated and compared to other DAWs has a much lower learning curve. But with no VST support and no audio editing (granted-some, but not nearly as extensive as other DAWs) or scoring / video capabilities Record seems to be designed for the "hobbyist /enthusiast" genre. The instruments bundled with this (which are slim) are so outdated you'd be very limited to purchase it without Reason (as intended). Overall, quality of sound seems strangely over-compressed and a bit dark to my ear- as does Reason. Is Record easy (or easier) to use?- yes. Open architecture?-no. Stellar sound quality?-debatable.

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  41. Of course it is a Digital (not analog) Audio (not visual) Workstation (not bedroom). In fact, it is PRECISELY a Digital Audio Workstation. What makes it great is it that it is finally what everyone wanted Reason to be: a full stand-alone multitrack MIDI synthesizer/drum machine recording workstation WITH analog input recording multi-track capability. Using Reason by itself has always been thrilling but then it has always been super annoying that you have to transfer stuff into your DAW to do the live analog tracks. Now the problem is solved: Do it all in one place. FINALLY. I guess that technically, it's a Stand Alone Digital-Analog Synthesizer Composing Recording Infinite Multitracker With A Few Limitations And Compressed Sound, or SADASCRIMWAFLACS.

    I'm going to try it out with my TC Electronic Konnekt 6 this weekend.

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  42. Without adding addition features to Record, I think that Propellerhead is doing the only thing that it can do. If Propellerhead indeed labels Record as a DAW, most potential customers are going to claim false advertising because Record doesn't have VST support and other features that have become accepted as being standard in a DAW.
    If they try to establish the fact that it is not a DAW, this forum has demonstrated that they will be put in the dog house.
    Damned if they do. Damned if they dont.

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  43. is it an Audio Workstation? does it happens in the digital world? I guess it is a DAW, I don't care about the GUI! its all digital! they are trying… i found high latency on recordings, no support for VST/RTAS, feels like an improved Garageband. i'll wont change my pro tools HD3 and UAD 2 for that! thats more for those people who does know some about audio, but nothing of engineering!

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  44. well you still cant chop and REVERSE audio.
    why do proppellerheads want to ignore reversing every time!
    sony acid pro is the best for editing audio by hand

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  45. This thing is only for hardcore reason diehards… No one else. If you already like reason, you more than likely will like record. If you already use ProTools, Logic, Live, etc… and can't stand the shitty reason (and now record) audio summing/output (as I do!), then you already don't fool with props and could care less. Carry on…

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  46. This thing is only for hardcore reason diehards… No one else. If you already like reason, you more than likely will like record. If you already use ProTools, Logic, Live, etc… and can't stand the shitty reason (and now record) audio summing/output (as I do!), then you already don't fool with props and could care less. Carry on…

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  47. Whatever Propellerhead want to call its new product, it serves the same basic purpose as any DAW on the market: to act as a digital platform in which sound can be recorded, toyed with, and played.

    In my view, Reason is NOT a DAW as it is unable to record live sound, although many other features are far superior to other workstations. The ability to record live sound must be an integral feature of any DAW.

    Record is a DAW. Why Propellerhead do not wish to designate it as such is most likely down to it’s marketing teams trying to get across the fact that ‘this is not a DAW: It is a fresh new take on music recording and production’.

    Combined with Reason 4, Record could be potentially huge in ability. I don’t think there are any systems around at the moment that 1) Is not open to 3rd party functions (such as VST etc.), 2) Has such an impressive range of features and 3) Is so stable.

    Yeah, it’s not perfect, but I know I am looking forward to the postman delivering my copy of Record, that’s for sure…

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  48. The only reason why they don't want to refer it as a DAW is because they didn't want to add VST's to it. Thus making it a so called Non-DAW software…

    To those without the knowledge, Digital audio workstation on Wikipedia has a list of DAW programs and "Reason" is one of them. If Propellerhead's definition of "digital" is synth based sounds and if Record doesn't have it (Which it does anyway), Then that would be the problem.

    BUT! it is Digital because it's on a computer correct? if it's not digital then what is it then? ORGANIC? ANALOG!? lol please….

    let's break it down.

    Digital = A digital system is a data technology.

    Audio = is characterized as a periodic vibration whose frequency is audible to the average human.

    Workstation = A workstation is a high-end microcomputer designed for technical or scientific applications.

    Digital Audio = uses digital signals for sound reproduction. which is Wave, MP3, ect ect.

    Now let's put Digital Audio with Workstation

    DAW = is an electronic system designed to record, edit and play back digital audio.

    WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT PROPELLERHEADS RECORD DOES!

    unless you've came up with some new way of recording that's not electronic or digital that's alienated to this planet, it will always be referred to as a DAW.

    Get over the "We're trying to be different" routine and accept the fact that it's a DAW. users will call it a DAW for the rest of eternity so get over it.

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  49. The only reason why they don't want to refer it as a DAW is because they didn't want to add VST's to it. Thus making it a so called Non-DAW software…

    To those without the knowledge, Digital audio workstation on Wikipedia has a list of DAW programs and "Reason" is one of them. If Propellerhead's definition of "digital" is synth based sounds and if Record doesn't have it (Which it does anyway), Then that would be the problem.

    BUT! it is Digital because it's on a computer correct? if it's not digital then what is it then? ORGANIC? ANALOG!? lol please….

    let's break it down.

    Digital = A digital system is a data technology.

    Audio = is characterized as a periodic vibration whose frequency is audible to the average human.

    Workstation = A workstation is a high-end microcomputer designed for technical or scientific applications.

    Digital Audio = uses digital signals for sound reproduction. which is Wave, MP3, ect ect.

    Now let's put Digital Audio with Workstation

    DAW = is an electronic system designed to record, edit and play back digital audio.

    WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT PROPELLERHEADS RECORD DOES!

    unless you've came up with some new way of recording that's not electronic or digital that's alienated to this planet, it will always be referred to as a DAW.

    Get over the "We're trying to be different" routine and accept the fact that it's a DAW. users will call it a DAW for the rest of eternity so get over it.

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  50. on reason pdf, they say something like ‘reason cant record audio, theres a lot of audio recording out there’, at that time when record not out yet, what i think about them is, god, if reason can record audio.. n maybe, so now, here come record, then i say, hmm.. its complete now. but i stil want, to produce my music with vst, n play live with them, n most of all, i tried to avoid using commercial vst, all my weird sound, both live n in studio is base on free vst, n record doesnt support vst means if i use it i also not support any free vst programer out there, as for record did.

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  51. I think we should call it a DAW-DUCK and be done with it. 🙂 Quack! Quack! Prop makes good stuff no matter what you call it, or what they call it. Just get busy and make some music! 🙂

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  52. Not a DAW?? to me it is… they didn't tell what the heck it is then… maybe a DAWG.
    maybe we can call it RSS (recording studio simulator)
    WHATEVER!!!

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  53. Not a DAW?? to me it is… they didn't tell what the heck it is then… maybe a DAWG.
    maybe we can call it RSS (recording studio simulator)
    WHATEVER!!!

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  54. Is it critical to Records success that it *NOT* be called a DAW? If so, it's already a failure. What people call this type of application is an absolute NON-ISSUE.

    I have respect for Propellerhead, and I think Reason is one of the most innovative products in the digital audio world. Getting stupid about the title DAW makes me not even want to bother with Record, simply because of the attitude about what they call it.

    So congratulations, Propellerhead, on releasing your first DAW application! DAW is the whole setup; DAW application is software that makes use of it. There, is that better? Can we get past the petty argument now? I'm embarrassed for them. And before ever even seeing it at work, the idea of Record is now sullied with this initial nonsense. Nice job, you fools.

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  55. Is it critical to Records success that it *NOT* be called a DAW? If so, it's already a failure. What people call this type of application is an absolute NON-ISSUE.

    I have respect for Propellerhead, and I think Reason is one of the most innovative products in the digital audio world. Getting stupid about the title DAW makes me not even want to bother with Record, simply because of the attitude about what they call it.

    So congratulations, Propellerhead, on releasing your first DAW application! DAW is the whole setup; DAW application is software that makes use of it. There, is that better? Can we get past the petty argument now? I'm embarrassed for them. And before ever even seeing it at work, the idea of Record is now sullied with this initial nonsense. Nice job, you fools.

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  56. realmente no importa si es o no a DAW lo que importa es si funciona bien o no y si facilita el trabajo con buenos resultados

    really it dosent matter if is a DAW or not what it is important is if works well and if makes easy to make music.

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  57. Record isnt a DAW, its crapware. I tried the demo, and I can give it points for the look and feel, but hated the workflow. I don't see any reason to switch from Studio One. Reason is a great program, and I love the hell out of it, but Record is just horrible.

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  58. Record isnt a DAW, its crapware. I tried the demo, and I can give it points for the look and feel, but hated the workflow. I don't see any reason to switch from Studio One. Reason is a great program, and I love the hell out of it, but Record is just horrible.

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  59. By now it could be also called a flop…did or have not heard much of Record at all in the last year

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  60. Wow, i'm not going to flame, but what are you basing this claim on? or are you just trolling? because i've used reason for a long time and the demo for record, and they have BOTH never failed me…

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  61. Wow, i'm not going to flame, but what are you basing this claim on? or are you just trolling? because i've used reason for a long time and the demo for record, and they have BOTH never failed me…

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  62. What ever, anybody thinks Record sounds fantastic out of the box, as an easy to use p.c./mac recording studio, it is just a shame the makers of such an innovation are so tied to their past glories i.e. reason re-birth.
    Come on get your act together introduce VSTi and take on the Big boys.
    Or are you scared?

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  63. WOW! I have to say that apart from a few intelligent comments from those people who get exactly what Record actually is (and is becoming, thanks to the new v1.5 update), I have never read so much garbage in all my life.

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  64. Get your facts straight, you Apple Zealot !!!

    Reason existed way before GarbageBand.

    Stop drinking the Kool-Aid, LOSER !!!

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  65. Why's everyone getting so uppity FFS! Does it matter what they want to refer to it as, it's not like it's knocked the planet off it's axis. :/

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  66. I wonder what makes something a Digital Audio Workstation? I just made a program called Rhythm Core Alpha that allows you to build tracks, edit them while playing, and solo over them live… on the Nintendo DSi! But it doesn't do digital audio recording, only sequencing and live performance. Does that count as a DAW?

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  67. If Record is or not a DAW. Yes it matters of course!

    We’re talking about a tool that works with digital audio yep? a expensive and limited tool, whose only advantage to my eyes is to provide a “standard” input/output accessibility to the tools on Reason and solve that artificial limitation (or “characteristic” to the enthusiasts).

    And what the concept of “musicians” to Prope? And “audio engineers” seems like that kids who plays free with cracked programs today?

    The flag “no DAW” there is just to dodge the faults in the market where you find “complicated” tools with similar price.

    good luck Prop.

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  68. Being a Reason user I think the Props. do have a solid point here in that Record is not a DAW. I mean; how much work can you do with Record without Reason being present ? Not that much I think…

    So wouldn't it be confusing for people who are unfamiliar with both Reason and Record to describe Record as a DAW? Because that in itself could give people the idea that with buying Record as a stand alone product they'd get a full blown audio workstation.

    But like.. Without Reason there really is not much point to Record.

    Just my 2 cents..

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  69. I agree 100% Record is not a daw. I use it and I cant get why people are raving about Record. Certainly the 5 star ratings it has got in some journals reeks more of payola than product quality. Record is a nice audio editing tool for Reason which Reason did not have before. That is a nice adition to Reason but its overpriced for the capability it delivers..
    Without plugin support it cant compete with any decent DAW and should not be getting the accolades it is currently receiving. FL9.6 is better featured and better value for money

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  70. Propellerhead its a DAW! for one thing its dealing in the "digital" domain, second it handles "audio" and third, the workstation is basically the overall system used to deal with the "digital audio" be it just software or not..sorry guys its a DAW

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  71. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  72. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  73. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  74. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  75. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  76. It's a DAW and notthing new nothing better than other ones on the market. Buy Logic it's much better and they are not rude when you trying to promote them!

    I'm not buying any of the propellerheads software after this! It's a buyer's market and I can't be bother with that attitude!

    Don't appologise they sucks not your coment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  77. Very acurate! They are just arogant, big players wannabe. They rock at time of reason 1 and rebirth but sence even garage band (free!) can do easier and give more at time of the rush! Record is so limited that is not funny so maybe we should call it LDAWWN Limited Digital Audio Workstation Worth Nothing!

    Suck this Propellerheads oIo

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  78. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

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  79. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

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  80. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

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  81. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  82. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

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  83. Vladimir my friend try something else and you will see that they sucks. Reason= very usable Record= very limited (enoying) Attitude= they can behave like that to they mums because I'm not buying they stuff even if it's the only s…. on the planet! We are the ones who buying they stuff and look how they treat the people who trying to help us with the news and help us to decide where is good to spend/save our money.

    Thank you propellerhead

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  84. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

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  85. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  86. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  87. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  88. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  89. you shouldn't get insulting with these idiotic Magritte-like comparisons of what is and what is not… it's just a matter of semantics so let it go!

    i use Ableton Live primarily, some people call it a DAW others call it a performance tool with some DAW-like features…whatever!

    when you find a piece of gear and get accustomed to it and it becomes an integral part of your workflow, who cares what it's called? some people have managed to make incredible boundary pushing music without DAW, like everyone using MPCs, or Monolake before the Ableton days, who mainly used Reaktor and Max/MSP…

    it's not the size of your piece that matters, it's what you can do with it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 2
  90. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  91. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  92. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  93. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 1
  94. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 0
  95. i used to use cracked software to make music…when i realised i wanted to pro and that my music what worth being heard by other people, i started paying for gear… i have a cracked version of Reason on my computer but never use for actual music production…even thought about buying version 5…ultimately it is better, i think, to get a piece of software you like working with, after trying it extensively even though it's illegal to use cracked software….and eventually when you realise you need it in your workflow, commit to it!

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 1
  96. When is the last time you used FL Studio? Right now, FL is the fastest way to arrange, period. Look at cakewalk now adapting a step sequencer that FL has had for ten years. There are nearly 5 complex steps in Cubase 5 in order to chop up a sample and trigger it on a pad. In FL you drop it into built in slicer and it automaps and you are done.

    Don't knock FL just because you didn't like it 4 years ago. It shits all over all other DAW's in terms of arranging. A few core elements remain problematic but they are being addressed.

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  97. I've allways liked the power and simplicity of reason. I did complete arrangements on a g4 powerbook.

    Version 4 added to much complexity.

    I don't know record, but I just think that the combo of reason + record is just to expensive. So when I finally decided I absolutely needed audio tracks I settled for Logic: it's cheaper, beautifully integrated and it's got wonderfull software-instruments and effects.

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  98. I still think it is a pity they did not bring audio into reason by simply modeling something like a AKAI D8.

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  99. The only failiers now in reason are 1. It doesn’t support vst, vsti’s 2. You have to use recycle outside of reason to sample, you end up with folders all over the place with all the extra steps involved and slows work flow.

    Reason+Record built into one program + drag and drop sampling inside reason without having to use recycle + vst support = the ultimate all in one DAW no need for any other programs. The effects in reason are the worst quality of all daws but if they allowed vst’s than it would not matter because all the best effects are vst’s anyway.

    If it was an all in one program with the vst support I would have no problem paying 600 for basic and 800 for the sampled library instrument versions.

    At this point FL Studio and Ableton Live have it beat at the price and options. If they just add vst support and combine internal sampling with more and better quality effects they would put ableton and FL out of business and steal a lot of PT and Logic users but they seem to be greedy marketing fools actually hurting their profit by not doing these things.

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  100. Hm well Record is a workstation that deals with audio that is digital. So the three words that best describe it are:
    1. Digital
    2. Audio
    and…
    3. Workstation

    Hmm that abbreviates to "DAW." Well lets just call it a "WDA" to avoid confusion. "DAW" is already used by other companies to describe some other software such as Pro Tools which I think is a kinda word processor or something.

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  101. reason doesnt limit.. you just dont know how to use it… the problem is not reason or record… its you

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 2
  102. anyone who is complaining about using the dongle either hasnt ever had pro tools, even le required the audio interface, is ignorant, or is planning on illegally using reason+record. i wish every program would use the same ilok system. it protects you, as well as them. i am completely against downloading illegal software and music, movies etc. so they make millions…… they worked hard on whatever you are stealing, and by stealing you are one of the reasons the economy is tanking. cheapskates and thieves. and you were cheap before the economy, so dont give me any bs that you were not. there is alot of plug ins that i wish i had that i cannot afford, still i havent used any pirated crap.

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  103. Record is a daw = digital audio workstation, especially if you have reason/ record combo is a major daw with a helluva mixer.

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  104. Seems to me they are just adding the rest of the program they should have included in the first place.

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  105. how fuckin sad is this heated debate………………..
    a political retards or what. Half the worlds starving!!! or getting bombed .

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  106. Reason +Record is as much a DAW as a Tomato is a fruit
    obviously it’s genetics prove that is a DAW, but to me it is so much more
    it’s more like a giant VST when using Rewire
    and with its virtual hardware rack, is it not a peice of “Virtual Studio Technology”?
    I’d consider it more of a VST workstation with the ability to work as a standalone DAW
    But seriously, it fits the DAW criteria
    so it is what it is

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  107. It’s a DAW. No sell without VST or AU support. Plain stupid move IMHO. BTW that SSL lookalike ain’t a mixer, it’s a sound twisting tool.

    Like this comment?: Thumb up 1
  108. the only problem with record is that it needs to be cracked (talkin about the 1.5) version…it does seem exptremely badass

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